We’re celebrating 100 episodes of Powered by Learning with a special conversation with past podcast guests Dr. Kristal Walker, Marjorie Van Roon, Ajay Pangarkar, Robyn DeFelice, and Connie Malamed. Together, we reflect on the past five years in L&D—AI’s promise (and limits), the rise of data-informed decisions, accountability for performance and ROI, and the renewed push for personalized, human-centered learning. Listen for an energizing look at where L&D is headed—and how your organization can evolve.

 

Show Notes:

Our podcast guests and co-hosts share practical perspectives you can use now while looking ahead to the future of L&D.

• AI is a powerful assistant and creative partner—use it to draft content, visuals, questions, and interactions, but always apply expert human review to ensure accuracy and instructional soundness. - Connie Malamed, Mastering Instructional Design Community 
   
• The real shift is toward data and performance—L&D must tighten its partnership with the business, lead with data-informed decisions, and mature its advisory role. - Robyn DeFelice, Learning Strategist 
   
• Treat AI as an accelerator, not a replacement—let it handle the basics so teams can focus on human-centered elements; expect growing emphasis on professional upskilling and certifications to keep a “seat at the table.” - Dr. Kristal Walker, VP Employee Wellbeing, Sweetwater 
   
• Accountability is rising—L&D must show performance and financial impact. Build financial literacy to demonstrate value or risk losing resources to other priorities. - Ajay Pangarkar, Author & Speaker 
   
• AI boosts brainstorming, editing, translation, and recommendations, but watch for bias, hallucinations, and cultural nuance; learners prefer shorter, visual, sometimes in-person experiences, and Gen Alpha will amplify demand for interactive, gamified learning. - Marjorie Van Roon, Senior Manager, Learning & Development, Best Buy Canada 
   

The d’Vinci co-hosts also shared some important key points:

• AI is still in its early days for L&D—what matters most is balancing ethical use with creating better, higher-impact learning. Instructional designers must remain the “human check and balance” to avoid bias, hallucinations, or copyright issues. - Luke Kempski, d’Vinci CEO
   
• AI works best as a creative partner and brainstorming tool. At d’Vinci, teams use it across functions—from design to strategy to development—but always within clear governance policies that align with client expectations. -  Mason Scuderi, d’Vinci President
   
• The rising learner demand for convenient, relevant, and personal training is pushing L&D professionals to grow their own design and consulting skills. The biggest opportunity ahead is balancing business impact with meaningful learner experiences. -Jenny Fedullo, d’Vinci Learning Experience Director
   
• Learners today want training that is purposeful, human-centered, and tied to performance outcomes. L&D must move beyond completions and focus on impact, using tech like AI only where it accelerates the process and keeping people at the core. - Angeline Evans, d’Vinci Client Solutions Consultant
   
• Data is shifting from a static, after-the-fact measurement to a real-time, predictive tool. Instead of waiting until the end to gauge effectiveness, L&D can now see how learners are engaging as they go, spot where they’re struggling, and adjust quickly. AI is also making competency mapping more dynamic, helping organizations identify gaps and proactively shape learning strategies. - Beth Buchanan, d’Vinci Senior Instructional Designer/Project Manager
   
• While AI is advancing rapidly, people remain the real drivers of success. L&D must continue developing leaders, building resilience, and creating inclusive workplaces—especially to support entry-level professionals who bring strong tech skills but seek organizations that will help them grow. - Eric McDonald, d’Vinci Director of Learning Technology

Thanks to the following d’Vinci team members for being a part of the first five years and 100 episodes of Powered by Learning:

Luke Kempski
Mason Scuderi
Angeline Evans
Jenny Fedullo
Beth Buchanan
Jenny Kerwin
Eric McDonald
Jenica Jones
And to Jonathan Lobaugh and Erica Synder for editing assistance.

Listen to these Powered by Learning episodes featuring the guests in our 100th episode.

Robyn DeFelice
Making the Most of Microlearning

Connie Malamed
Improving Usability in Learning Experience Design

Ajay Pangarkar
Unlock Organizational Value with Learning Metrics

Read Learning Metrics, by Ajay Pangarkar 

Marjorie Van Roon
Driving Retail Performance with Training

Dr. Kristal Walker
Helping Associates Find Their Sound

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Susan Cort: [00:00:00] Since we launched d’Vinci's podcast in 2020, Learning & Development has transformed in ways we could hardly imagine then and now as Powered by Learning celebrates its 100th episode, we're reflecting on what's changed and what's next in the field of learning and development.

Kristal Walker: One of the biggest changes that I've noticed is that you have a lot of learning and development professionals who them.

Sales are looking to upskill at an even faster pace, especially with the onset of AI. I think that excites me the most because the stronger we are as a practitioner group, the stronger we are as an industry.

Susan Cort: That's Dr. Kristal Walker, Vice President of Employee Wellbeing at Sweetwater. She and past Powered by Learning guests Connie Malamed, Ajay Pangarkar, Robyn DeFelice and Marjorie Van Roon. Join us to mark our milestone episode and share how L&D has evolved over the past five years and where it's headed [00:01:00] next on Powered by Learning.

Announcer: Powered by Learning is brought to you by d’Vinci Interactive d’Vinci's approach to learning is grounded in 30 years of innovation and expertise. We use proven strategies and leading technology to develop solutions that empower learners to improve quality and boost performance. Learn more at dvinci.com.

Susan Cort: Welcome to Powered by Learning. I'm your host, Susan Cort. Joining me today are some of our esteemed past podcast guests, Dr. Kristal Walker, Vice President of Employee Wellbeing at Sweetwater; Connie Malamed, publisher of the e-Learning Coach website and podcast, and founder of the Mastering Instructional Design community; Robyn DeFelice, author, consultant and learning strategist; Ajay Pangarkar, author and award-winning performance strategist focused on workplace development; and Marjorie Van Roon, Senior [00:02:00] Manager Learning and Development at Best Buy Canada. We invited our past guests to join us on this special episode and are so thankful that these distinguished thought leaders could participate. I asked each one a series of questions and we'll share some of their responses.

Over the next 30 minutes. We'll also hear from some of our d’Vinci team members who serve as podcast co-hosts. To get started, of course, one of the biggest game changers has been artificial intelligence. So, I asked, how have you seen AI transform the way e-learning is created or delivered? AI has quickly become a talking point in learning and development.

Our guests had some interesting perspectives on how it's shaping e-learning today. Let's start with Connie Malamed.

Connie Malamed: I've been watching how AI is reshaping the way we create and deliver e-learning in the broader industry. In workplace training professionals embraced AI very quickly to speed up a surprising [00:03:00] number of tasks, and of course, they've been getting mixed results along the way.

At a basic level, AI is really acting as an assistant and a creative partner. Learning teams are using it to draft course content, create graphics, and generate quiz questions, scenarios, and Interactive exercises. Everything that AI produces still needs a careful human review and fine tuning by experienced practitioners, you know, to make sure it's accurate, meaningful, and instructionally sound.

Susan Cort: Robin DeFelice agreed that AI is making waves, but she cautioned that it isn't the only big change happening in our field.

Robyn DeFelice: We could all probably agree that AI is the biggest change we've seen in L&D, but I really don't believe that that's it. I just think that's what's getting all the noise right now.

Where I really think that the attention is turning to [00:04:00] is also technology based, but it's more about data and data and performance, and I think those are the trends that we're seeing. That trend is then being backdrop by the need for the L&D function to be a stronger leader, a trusted advisor. You know, the partner that we haven't been being

Susan Cort: At Sweetwater, Dr. Kristal Walker says AI has helped her team improve the learning experience for us.

Kristal Walker: We believe that AI has become more of an accelerator than a replacement, if anything. It actually help us to get the basics down pretty quickly. So whether that's, uh, creating mini lectures, a toolkit, a participant workbook or facilitator guide, for example, we see AI as allowing us to free up most of our team's time to focus on more of the human side of the learning experience.

If we may need to go in and add content or personal stories or personal, an adults that really can connect the real-world application. Of the training to the learning experience so that [00:05:00] it all resonates better with the learner. That's a win for us. So, I think in summary, AI for us gets us to a good place really, really fast so that we can spend more time or energy making the learning great.

Susan Cort: AI is helping Best Buy Canada make learning great, but it has its pros and cons according to Marjorie Van Roon.

Marjorie Van Roon: When it comes to creating and delivering e-learning at our organization, AI has been both a boon and a bit of a letdown. On the bright side, AI is an excellent brainstorming partner. It often suggests different ways to structure a topic, and sometimes it offers great perspectives that we might not have considered.

Also really great at editing and refining content. In fact, I used it today to help me refine my answers for the podcast. Most of the tools we use to create e-learning now come with AI integration, making the process seamless. AI is also fantastic at generating images, although we've received feedback from a small group of employees [00:06:00] who aren't big fans of the AI created images.

It's worth noting that AI can have really strong biases in both image and content creation, which can be a hurdle when we're trying to go for diversity. Being in Canada, we need to offer all of our training in both English and French. AI has significantly sped up the translation times, though again, we need to make sure that we're still reviewing and editing the translations to ensure accuracy.

However, AI still isn't a magic bullet. I wouldn't rely on it to create a course from start to finish, as it still tends to hallucinate and we always need to fact check. Additionally, AI doesn't fully grasp the culture of our organization, so there there's some nuanced ways with that. We create training that it just doesn't get yet.

Susan Cort: The second question we asked our guests is: what's one way you think AI will change how we design or personalize learning experiences In the next few years? Our guests highlighted [00:07:00] personalization and freeing up time for more strategic work. Ajay Pangarkar says that AI will handle routine tasks so learning leaders can focus on higher value contributions.

Ajay Pangarkar: Well, the changes that I see happening with AI in L&D is that like a lot of professions. It's going to eliminate the fundamental tasks that we do, um, day in and day out, which to me, I believe is a good thing because it's gonna push us as a community to be higher level thinkers, meaning that we have to look at drawing value in a new way, um, into the future and how it affects the organization.

And that being said, AI will take the rote responsibilities that sort of bog down our time. Give us opportunity to create some really valuable experiences within the organization and may dare I say, targeted ones as well. Now, AI can also help us and supplement that help to allow us to target the right areas.

So as AI [00:08:00] grows in, in, in, in smartness, if you want to call it in intelligence, over time, I believe we're gonna see a lot of partnership with ai. L&D and, and AI will come together to really show some interesting things that will happen within the organization. And help us focus our efforts and think at a higher level and deliver at a higher level, and of course, reduce waste of time in areas that we really should not be paying attention to.

Susan Cort: Connie Malamed added that AI is already helping to personalize learning in new ways.

Connie Malamed: What's really interesting is that at a more advanced level, people are finding new ways to personalize learning, like creating chat bots with specialized knowledge. Learners can then ask the chat bot questions, get answers, and interact for personalized help.

Another more advanced use I'm seeing is non coders experimenting with extensions and plugins [00:09:00] for authoring platforms, using AI tools that will create code like Lovable and repl. These are being used to extend the capabilities of a learning platform. And will most likely be a future trend to watch.

Susan Cort:

Kristal Walker sees a lot of value in AI for professional development, too.

Kristal Walker: I personally see AI taking us from more of a one size fits all approach to maybe a, just for me, sort of personal learning experience. So, if you were to imagine, you know, uh, a learner being greeted by an avatar that kind of reflects their style.

Or having a virtual coach walk them through how to apply the skills after the training. And I think those are the benefits and ways that we can incorporate AI. You can also tailor those personal avatars to the learning type. So, if it's a leadership development training, for example, you might have, um, a senior leader.

You know, uh, who can have an AI avatar [00:10:00] created for them and their image. Imagine having that as opposed to having them try to find time on their calendar to greet learners as they embark upon this learning journey. So, I think things like that, being able to personalize learning as much as we could, and having that sort of coaching, uh, once the training has concluded to make it stick, is where I see AI making the biggest impact for us, at least.

It's a great way to leverage this technology so that we can make the learning more personal for our learners, uh, and then still have a root in what we know that actually works.

Susan Cort: Marjorie Van Roon shares how some of the AI tools are supporting their training initiatives

Marjorie Van Roon: As far as designing learning experiences, I think tools like at Synthesia make it so that you don't really need to spend so much time producing learning that requires a talking head.

Though it's still a little bit clunky and sometimes has that uncanny valley feeling, I think these tools will get better and be [00:11:00] more integrated into the software that we currently use. I'm really excited to see where this is gonna be in five years’ time. As far as personalizing the learning experience, our LMS is already using AI to recommend courses to people, and that's a great start.

I'd love to see AI being used to assess the skills of people before they take courses to get an understanding of where they're at today and then how much they've learned. Coursera is already doing that and they're doing a great job with that. Make no mistake, AI is the biggest change that we've seen in many years.

It's a wonderful tool that can help expedite different tasks. Though it may not be able to create a robust, perfectly designed course from beginning to end, it helps with many parts of that process from idea generation to handling some of the logistics that are part of delivering and tracking a course and its attendees.

I actually really like using it to create Excel formulas when I'm stuck, [00:12:00] it's quite remarkable and I can only see it gaining traction.

Susan Cort: Let me bring in d’Vinci's, Luke Kempski and Mason Scuderi. Hello to you both.

Luke Kempski: Hi Susan, hey Mason.

Mason Scuderi: Hi, Susan.

Susan Cort: I'd like to get your thoughts on the comments about artificial intelligence from our guests.

Luke Kempski: It definitely still feels like we're at the very, very beginning of AI's impact on training, education, learning, and while that's definitely true and we're all kind of projecting how it connects with a path into the future. You still get to that fundamental, it's a balance between ethical use of AI and, you know, using AI to make better learning experiences and with a higher impact more efficiently.

What do you think, Mason?

Mason Scuderi: Yeah, I agree. It was really great to hear the, the guests talk about AI's strength as, as an assistant for lower level tasks and, and a creative partner, you know, that helps them take their work to the next level. Also to hear the [00:13:00] weaknesses that they were experiencing in, in the current state of the technology with image generation and, uh, content generation, not, you know, not quite being ready to, to use at that level and help their team.

So I think it's definitely something we all have our eyes on, uh, very closely. How it's developing.

Luke Kempski: You continue to hear it's a tool, right? A tool for the instructional designer, developer learning experience creator, and that. It helps them be more productive. But then also they have to understand how to be the check and balance, the human check and balance, you know, making sure it's accurate.

It's not hallucinating, making sure there's not bias embedded in it. Uh, making sure that you're not, um, violating, uh, copyrights. All the different things that you have to be sensitive about. Um, all contained in the point of view that we created way back in 2023 in the spring, that guide our team members into.

To express our point of view when it comes to [00:14:00] using generative AI to our clients.

Susan Cort: Mason, talk a little bit about that, our, our point of view and, and also how you've seen, uh, the d’Vinci team utilize AI.

Mason Scuderi: Sure, yeah. Our point of view has, has been essential, um, especially with how closely we work with our clients and partner with our clients.

Uh, it allows them to understand. Our governance policy and our rules for the road. Many of our clients have their own governance policies and, and have, you know, different thoughts on how they're using AI and, and how they want their vendor partners to use AI or not use AI. Uh, so it's really, really been essential both for our clients and for our team to, to understand the rules for the road.

And I think how we're using AI at d’Vinci really echoes a lot of our, our guests input. We're using it as a creative and, you know, inspiration brainstorming partner, really across the board from the leadership team to our graphic designers. It is a great companion, uh, and co-pilot, uh, no pun intended, uh, you know, with instructional [00:15:00] designers, you know, using it to analyze content and, you know, and breakdown content and gain insights to create better learning strategies.

Then from a technical standpoint, enabling AI solutions to help empower personalization, such as an AI chat bot, which we recently implemented and generating dynamic lesson plans for our educational customers. So it, it's been an exciting journey so far and it's, uh, really great to hear that our experiences is, uh, mirroring our guests insights.

Susan Cort: Yeah, it's definitely been a journey and I think one of the most exciting things is how we learn from each other, not only here at d’Vinci, but from our guests, from the Power By Learning podcast, and everyone in the industry as we all navigate this together.

Luke Kempski: Well put.

Susan Cort: Well, thank you both. You have been invaluable partners and are Powered by Learning journey from concepting to bringing on really dynamic guests to sharing your many years of experience. I can't thank you enough for your support.

Luke Kempski: Let's go for 200.

Susan Cort: Sounds good.

Luke Kempski: Thanks, Susan. [00:16:00]

Susan Cort: Next, we asked our guests, what are the biggest changes you've seen in L&D in recent years, and where do you see trends going?

While AI dominates the headlines, our guests pointed to other important shifts that may shape the future of learning. Robyn DeFelice sees data as the most important driver.

Robyn DeFelice: First and foremost, data. Data is the demand right now, and that is the trend. Pretty much many organizations do not tie the L&D function to strategic business outcomes.

That means it makes it more difficult for the L&D function to help use that trend and make it part of the business process. There are many systemic things sitting underneath that L&D piece. That in recent years is getting the attention, but the traction to change it is still not as prevalent. But I do think that that is the next wave of big change we will see in the upcoming years where the L&D function gets to take a hold of data, make it more meaningful, not just to make decisions about [00:17:00] what the learner needs, but also about how the L&D function operates and performs for the organization itself.

Susan Cort: Ajay Pangarkar pointed to accountability, both performance and financial as another trend that can't be ignored.

Ajay Pangarkar: One thing that I see as a trend for L&D specifically is accountability, right? So ,we talked about performance, accountability, how we show learning has made a difference within the organization.

I speak a lot about that in my book, The Learning Metrics. Um, but I also speak in The Learning Metrics, which is not, the light is not shown upon. A lot is financial accountability, right? How do we play in the world of the numbers and the money within the organization? And I always say, if you're not delivering value, both performance wise and financial to your decision makers, they will allocate resources to other areas that are so, sharpen your tools, you know, and, um, learn about this stuff.

But, [00:18:00] uh, suffice to say that. You're going to have to understand some financial literacy, and that's a trend coming up to understand how your money is allocated, where it's going, what it's doing.

Susan Cort: Kristal Walker is seeing a trend that L&D professionals want to learn more to ensure their value to their organizations and in the field in general.

Kristal Walker: One of the biggest changes that I've noticed is that you have a lot of learning and development professionals. Who themselves are looking to upskill at an even faster pace, especially with the onset of, uh, AI. I think more of us are pursuing certifications or advanced training opportunities, not just to add letters behind our names, but more so to keep our seat at the table and really show that learning is a serious business driver for the organizations that we support.

The trend that I typically see the most is that professional certifications is, is really no longer an option. It's actually becoming a standard in our field, especially if you wanna be a sought after thought leader in the learning and development space. And [00:19:00] honestly, I think that excites me the most because the stronger we are as a practitioner group, the stronger we are as an industry.

Susan Cort: Learners are changing too, bringing new expectations about how training should fit into their lives. Connie Malamed explains.

Connie Malamed: What I've picked up on over the years is that learner preferences are a bundle of subtleties, nuances, and perhaps even contradictions. First, everyone seems increasingly busy and overwhelmed. Learners want their training to focus on what's necessary and relevant for building the skills they need.

On the other hand, if a course is meaningful to their world as well as engaging. Participants might be willing to stick with it for a longer time. Here's another preference. Employees have accepted technology-based training because it is available everywhere and at any time. However, learners are [00:20:00] sophisticated, and if the training was just thrown together without much thought, it will become obvious and they won't engage.

Often, what does engage people is the human component, perhaps a course with the facilitator who provides a safe space for learning interesting discussions and a friendly cohort. People are complicated.

Susan Cort: Kristal Walker and Marjorie Van Roon agree that learner expectations are changing.

Kristal Walker: I believe learners today don't want, uh, training just to check a box.

I know that's been a desire for us in the past, but I feel like we have so many more tools that are available and accessible to us in order to make sure that we can actually help training stick. I think a lot of learning professionals are looking for experiences where they can create bite-size training training that's a bit more flexible and immediately useful for the learners that we're creating training for.

I think learners themselves also wanna know, you know, how is this gonna help me today? [00:21:00] It's great to be able to look ahead and see that technology is gonna play a role in our learning experience, but how's the training that we're expecting our learners to attend or participate in today gonna help them?

I think it's important that we not lose sight of the fact that AI is gonna play a role in the training. It's still important that people are learning and they're motivated and they have personal and professional development goals around their learning.

Marjorie Van Roon: Another change - time and budget restraints. We need to be mindful of how much training we expect our employees to complete.

Our store operating models have evolved over the years, and there's less downtime for additional tasks like training. We must be laser-focused on creating impactful training experiences that are also cost-effective. A change I'm happy to see is a significant movement towards delivering training in person.

While virtual sessions were a great stopgap solution. People are craving the [00:22:00] connection and networking opportunities that only come with in-person classes. I think learner preferences have changed over the years. They want short training. People want concise training sessions. No one has time to sit through a 30-minute e-module anymore.

Attention spans have changed, and we've had to adapt by structuring our training to deliver short bursts of insight rather than a drawn-out course. If the course is longer, we break it down into easily digestible sections. Video training is another thing that people are really preferring these days.

Visual learning is in high demand. Some concepts are challenging for people to grasp through text or interactivity alone, especially if English is a second language. They wanna see examples and understand what good looks like through video training and what's ahead. Our Gen Alpha employees will soon be entering the workforce.

For my research, it's clear that we'll have to accelerate our [00:23:00] training pace and make it even more visual and Interactive. They love solving problems and using their critical thinking skills, which they're learning really early in school these days. I foresee a lot of gamification, animation, providing them with the tools to find answers for themselves.

It's gonna be an exciting and dynamic shift.

Susan Cort: Let me bring in d’Vinci's, Jenny Fedullo and Angeline Evans. Hi Jenny. Hi Angeline.

Jenny Fedullo: Hey, great to see you.

Angeline Evans: Hi, Susan.

Susan Cort: Thank you so much for joining us on this special 100th episode. So you both work with d’Vinci clients and help them navigate the training challenges in their organizations.

What do you think about our guest comments about how L&D professionals are evolving and how learners' needs are changing too?

Angeline Evans: You know, it's really energizing to hear how our guests are embracing change. Learners are short on time, they have high expectations, and they want training that's purposeful. So that means our job just isn't just to make training more engaging, it's to make it more human centered.

Jenny Fedullo: I agree. [00:24:00] Angeline, I mean, what really stood out to me is how. Learner expectations and L&D professionals growth are, are just so connected. Learners want training that's convenient, relevant, personal. They want to know how is this gonna help me in my role? So that demand is really pushing us as practitioners to keep evolving.

So we're exploring new tools and trying to really strengthen our design and consulting skills really to, to ensure that what we're producing is meaningful for the learner and impactful for the business. So striking that balance is, is really the biggest opportunity for L&D moving forward From, from my perspective.

Angeline Evans: Yes. And you know, we're seeing organizations rethink how they are measuring success, right? So it's not just about completion rates anymore, it's about truly moving the needle on performance and aligning with the strategic goals of their business. That's where data personalization and thoughtful use of AI have really been coming into play.

And I loved what Kristal said about ai freeing up time to focus on the human side of learning. At d’Vinci, we're leaning into that balance. [00:25:00] So we're using tech, work and accelerate and people where it matters most.

Jenny Fedullo: I agree. And one other point is we, we always do a discovery session with our clients. One of the questions we always ask is, how are we gonna measure success?

And so often, for years it's been. Number of completions, right? But now answers are starting to come. Well, we wanna see an increase in this, or we wanna see a decrease in this. So they're, they're getting smarter and they're tying it more to performance, which is exciting, uh, to see.

Susan Cort: Thank you both for all your hard work on Powered by Learning.

It is always a pleasure to host an episode when the two of you are involved.

Jenny Fedullo: You're welcome. Thank you. I'm glad I was tapped to be part of this hundredth episode.

Angeline Evans: Thanks, Susan. Yes. A hundred episodes. So exciting.

Susan Cort: It is, it's a big celebration. Thank you both. Next, we asked our guests about the industry trends that most excite them.

Let's first hear from Robyn  DeFelice.

Robyn DeFelice: We're being asked to use the data, but we haven't been given the time or opportunity to be able to build the capabilities towards being able to use that data [00:26:00] really effectively. Not just to tell you about the learner, but how to make good business decisions as an L&D function.

So I'm super, it's excited about data being a trend and a demand for it. What I'm really hoping is that L&D comes alongside that demand and says, that's great. We wanna do that for you, but here's all the things that we need. To help us make sure that we're doing this right for you and you're own not getting half of what you need.

I think that's the really important piece, and that's why it's so exciting because those are the things that I love to do. I think this is where we're going to start shining really bright because there's so many people that I've worked with in the last year that I'm telling you, they're sitting there waiting.

They've got their data, they've got the story. They just don't have leadership and stakeholders that have been willing to listen.

Susan Cort: Kristal Walker is looking forward to a greater emphasis on competency models.

Kristal Walker: I see more and more organizations, including our organization actually developing these proprietary models that actually go beyond just a simple list of skills.

I think competency models are [00:27:00] great for defining what success looks like in our, our learning cultures. Uh, that kind of clarity is pretty powerful, uh, when it comes to creating a culture of learning because it transitions learning from just this sort of generic activity that we do into something that's a little bit more laser focused and actionable and career oriented.

I think competency models gives leaders and employees sort of a clear roadmap when it comes to. How do you connect, uh, that roadmap to development programs? And then, uh, once you're able to do that, then I think that's when you really start to see the culture shift from more of just a working business operations culture to that plus a learning and development culture, a true culture of learning and development.

Susan Cort: I'd like to bring in d’Vinci's Beth Buchanan to add to this. Hi Beth.

Beth Buchanan: Hi, Susan.

Susan Cort: Beth, what do you see changing as it relates to data in L&D?

Beth Buchanan: That's a great question. What I see changing most in L&D [00:28:00] is how we're using data in real time, and I know we've been doing that for a while, but it is still something that gets better and better all the time.

So instead of waiting till the end to measure effectiveness, we can see how people are engaging as they learn, right, where they're struggling, what's sticking. And that means we can adjust much faster and make learning feel more like a live process rather than just a one time event. And then the other big shift is how AI is shaping all of this, right?

So data is helping us really become predictive rather than reactive. And I can give you an example of that with competency mapping. So, you know, competency mapping used to be a very static exercise. Uh, we would build a framework and then maybe update it every few years, and that was it. But now it's a much more dynamic thing, right?

So AI allows us to. You know, this is something we see with some of our law enforcement clients where data informs [00:29:00] the competency maps from the start. So mapping is still used to find skill gaps, but it's also used to be predictive where the deeper engagement is needed, and then give us ideas on how to do that, how to build those scenarios and feel confident that they're gonna deliver impact.

Susan Cort: Great insights, Beth. Thank you for being a co-host on Powered By Learning over the last few years. You always bring great insights to the conversations with our guests. I really appreciate it.

Beth Buchanan: Oh, thank you, Susan. It's always a lot of fun.

Susan Cort: Finally, I asked our guests, what topics would you like to see us discuss in the next 100 episodes of Powered By Learning?

Kristal Walker: I think I love to see, uh, us balance the conversations about AI with conversations about the human side of performance. I know technology is gonna always evolve. There's no doubt about that at all. Um, but in my experience, I think people succeed when they have clarity around expectations and a clear path to grow.

Um, I like to hear more about building resilience, especially in a time where we're kind of required to jump on board [00:30:00] when it comes to a lot of the advanced technology. To be able to hear more about creating inclusive work spaces, and I love to also hear more about tools and best practices for developing, uh, leaders, empowering others.

I think at the end of the day, AI is just a tool. People are the real difference makers. And if we aren't intentional about empowering others or developing leaders who can actually help manage a lot of these resources, uh, I think it's an area that we might eventually fall short.

Robyn DeFelice: Highlighting topics around that like – what is operational, you know, efficiency look like? What is maturity in capabilities and capacity? What does that look like for an L&D function? How does an L&D function demonstrate its own business acumen and business contributions to the organization? I would love to see any and all of those topics being expressed by Powered by Learning, and I know that they can do it because there's so many awesome people that d’Vinci knows that they can bring to the table to talk [00:31:00] about these amazing things.

Susan Cort: Thank you, Kristal and Robyn. d’Vinci's, Director, Learning Technology, Eric McDonald is with us now.

Eric McDonald: Hi Susan.

Susan Cort: Hi Eric. Listening to the suggestions for future episodes, what do you think of those ideas and what else do you think would be relevant to our listeners in the near future?

Eric McDonald: Well, I think Kristal and Robyn both shared some important points.

Uh, Kristal reminded us that while AI continues to advance, people are really what drive success. So, with that in mind, we need to continue to develop leaders, build resilience, and create supportive workplaces. I'll also add that an inclusive workplace is especially important when we consider entry-level professionals.

They typically bring, uh, fluency with ai. In general technology and are looking for places that will help them grow their careers. Providing opportunities to lead is critical for the future of our organizations. And finally, I agree with Robyn. There are so many great perspectives we can bring into [00:32:00] future episodes.

The variety of guests so far has been amazing. A hundred episodes is a major accomplishment and a testament to all the hard work you've put into it. So, congratulations on reaching this milestone.

Susan Cort: Aw, thanks Eric. Thanks to you and the rest of the d’Vinci team for being such a big part of the success of our podcast.

We're going to look forward to exploring some of these topic ideas, and we want to remind our listeners that we're always open to their suggestions for topics and guests. Lastly, some of our guests were kind enough to share their congratulations on our 100th episode.

Ajay Pangarkar: I want to congratulate the Powered by Learning podcast and d’Vinci for such wonderful work that they do through this podcast.

Thank you, Susan, and thank you to the team for doing this. Um, I hope to be part of it in the future. I wish you continued success and another hundred episode plus more. So keep it up to good work.

Connie Malamed: This is Connie Malamed. Congratulations on your 100th episode, [00:33:00] so I'm excited about what's to come.

Kristal Walker: I look forward in being able to listen to this podcast as well as the next 100 episode.Thank you so much for having me.

Susan Cort: My thanks to our special guest for joining us today, Dr. Kristal Walker, Marjorie Van Roon, AJ Pangarkar, Robyn DeFelice and Connie Malamed. I'll also put links to their past podcast interviews with us in the show notes. Thanks too, to Powered by Learning co-hosts, Luke Kempski, Mason Scuderi, Angeline Evans, Jenny Fedullo, Beth Buchanan, and Eric McDonald.

I appreciate you sharing your knowledge and how you bring out the best insights for our guests. And last but not least, thanks to all of you for listening. Since we launched Powered By Learning, we have dropped 100 episodes, had close to 10,000 episode downloads, and won a few awards along the way. But the most important accomplishment is about the conversations we've had, the lessons we've learned, and the community we've built together.

So let's keep learning from [00:34:00] one another as we shape what's next in learning and development. Here's to the next 100 episodes of Powered By Learning.

 

 

Recent onboarding statistics from the Society for Human Resource Management (SHRM) validate that organizations with formal onboarding programs experience 50% higher employee retention and a 62% increase in productivity among new hires.

Yet too often, onboarding is treated as an HR checkbox instead of a strategic advantage. Onboarding isn’t just a formality—it’s your chance to make a lasting first impression on the people who will represent your mission every day.

In today’s competitive market, where attention is short and expectations are high, onboarding is more than a welcome packet. It’s a brand experience. It’s a culture builder. It’s a retention strategy.

And yes, it still matters—now more than ever.

What’s New in Onboarding: Trends Shaping Today’s Experiences

• Personalization at Scale: New hires expect tailored experiences. Role-based pathways, persona-driven content, and modular eLearning allow for scale and specificity.
• Extended Journeys: From preboarding to 30/60/90-day checkpoints—and even full first-year programs—onboarding is no longer limited to the first week.
• Human + Digital Blends: Virtual mentors, video introductions, mobile-friendly modules, and scheduled live check-ins strike the right balance.
• Data-Driven Improvements: The best programs are measured. Think feedback loops, pulse surveys, and analytics that inform future iterations.
• Accessibility + Inclusion: WCAG-compliant experiences, closed captions, and screen reader-friendly content ensure everyone can engage.

Your Blueprint: d’Vinci’s Onboarding Planning Guide

Before jumping into platforms or content, we help clients start with purpose. Our Onboarding Planning Guide is a foundational tool to align stakeholders and clarify the onboarding experience.

Key questions include:

• What KPIs are you trying to impact?
• Where does onboarding begin?
• How should onboarding reflect your mission, values, and brand identity?
• What should employees know, feel, and do by each milestone?
• Who owns which parts—HR, IT, Marketing, the manager?

Real-World Results: 3 Client Spotlights

Constellation Brands
Challenge: Equip field sales reps with brand knowledge, tools, and confidence.
Solution: A 6-week immersive journey blending brand modules, checklists, mentorship, and cultural immersion.
Why it worked: It aligned onboarding with brand power and performance goals.

Learn more about the work

SCORE Association
Challenge: Refresh outdated onboarding for a national volunteer network.
Solution: Updated Storyline modules with a modern interface, improved accessibility, and content aligned to SCORE’s mentoring approach and organizational values.
Why it worked: Brand-aligned, mission-driven, and accessible.

Learn more about the work

A Fortune 500 Transportation Leader
Challenge: Standardize onboarding across site leaders.
Solution: Six short videos in Articulate Rise, covering pre- to post-onboarding.
Why it worked: Short, visual, consistent training for time-strapped leaders.

Take Action: Two Ways to Strengthen Onboarding Today

1. Download our Onboarding Planning Guide to reflect on your goals, messages, and delivery strategy.
2. Schedule a free discovery session with our team. We'll walk you through our design approach and explore onboarding success for your organization.

Ready to turn your first impression into lasting impact? Let’s talk about what onboarding could (and should) do for you. 

Are you looking for practical ways to integrate AI into your instructional design workflow? Wondering how it can add real value to your process? Or hoping to work more efficiently while boosting creativity? When used thoughtfully, AI can enhance your thinking, help you expand your ideas, and offer fresh perspectives.

So, where should you begin? Let’s walk through how AI can support different phases of instructional design—especially in content development.

Discover

During the research phase, AI can be your research partner. Whether you're reviewing SME materials or doing independent research, AI tools can help speed things up. You can upload source documents and ask ChatGPT to summarize the content, generate outlines, define key terms, or answer questions. You can also use ChatGPT to identify any missing content or ask it to add more to what you already have. 

Want more audience-specific insight? Try asking ChatGPT to role-play your learner personas. While it can't replace thoughtful consultation or root-cause analysis, it can help you explore how a learner might respond to your content or what questions they might ask. You can also use it to rehearse how you'd explain the material to that persona—and even have it quiz you to reinforce key points. Used this way, AI becomes a thought partner that helps you refine your learner-centered design. Our Director of Learning Experience, Jenny Fedullo says this about the limitations of AI use: 

"I wouldn’t use AI to determine what a learner truly needs or to define the root cause of a performance problem. That kind of insight requires human analysis, thoughtful questioning, and collaboration with the client—something AI can’t replicate. It’s a great support tool, but not a replacement for consultation and expertise."

What about data? Do you have learner surveys or interview responses that you’re unsure how to analyze? ChatGPT is a great tool to use to analyze that data, giving you insights quicker and easier than before. ChatGPT can identify common themes, pain points, or areas of confusion.

Imagine

AI shines in the brainstorming phase. Need scenario ideas? Want to create a game or story but don’t know where to start? ChatGPT makes ideation fast and flexible. No perfect prompt needed—just speak naturally. For example: “I’m working on an asynchronous game about energy consumption. I want it to give points for correct answers as the learner moves through a house answering questions about the topic. I want them to be rewarded with stickers or badges as they answer questions correctly. Help me build it out.” That’s enough detail to get started. You can even ask it to improve your prompt or generate one for you. The more you use it, the better your results will be.

Ashlea Novalis, Instructional Designer/Project Manager at d’Vinci gave this example of how she uses AI during brainstorming:

“I’ll ask for ideas on how to break down a complex topic as a way to get "unstuck" when I’m staring at a blank screen.”

With recent advances in ChatGPT’s image generation, you can now create mock-ups, avatars, graphs, and more to visualize ideas quickly and clearly. When our team was developing a game concept, our developer Grady Shingler used ChatGPT to generate interface mock-ups that became the foundation for a playthrough demo. Instead of relying on generic visuals or waiting on a designer, he turned those mock-ups into a functional preview that brought our concept to life. The client immediately grasped the gameplay and design, thanks to the realistic visuals—and we saved valuable development time in the process.

Create

Writing learning objectives or drafting a storyboard? AI can save you valuable time. Give it your source materials or a rough draft, and it can generate objectives aligned with Bloom’s Taxonomy or refine what you’ve already written. When I use ChatGPT to write learning objectives, the results are usually strong—I often just tweak the verbs to better match the intended cognitive level.
AI also helps elevate the tone of your writing. I use it to turn my matter-of-fact first drafts into something more creative and learner-friendly. I simply ask ChatGPT to improve readability and adapt the tone for the audience. The result is still my voice—just with a bit more polish.

Beth Buchanan, a Senior Instructional Designer/Project Manager at d’Vinci, shared this example: 

“I often use AI to generate knowledge check distractors. I find that it creates strong and realistic alternate answers when I feed it the correct one. I used to struggle with crafting distractors that weren’t obviously wrong, but AI seems to pull in adjacent and plausible information that works well.”

Even this blog post was drafted with the help of ChatGPT. I used it to organize my thoughts, clarify my goals, and shape a coherent structure. It’s like having a behind-the-scenes writing coach that helps turn your ideas into polished content.

Review

The final phase of instructional design is all about testing and refining—and AI makes a great second set of eyes. ChatGPT can review your work for grammar, clarity, structure, and tone, ensuring your content is clean and professional. It can also assist with accessibility tasks like writing alt text, simplifying language, or ensuring instructions are universally understandable.

Want a fresh perspective? Ask AI to review your learning objectives or assessments for alignment. It can flag potential gaps, suggest improvements, or evaluate if the questions truly measure the intended outcomes. You can even use it to create a checklist of what to test during your review cycle.

One standout feature to try is Canvas by OpenAI—a visual workspace that makes reviewing and refining content more collaborative and intuitive. If you haven’t explored it yet, it’s definitely worth a look.

If you started this post wondering how AI could actually support your instructional design work, hopefully you now have some real answers—and a few new ideas. From early research to final review, AI can enhance your process, expand your thinking, and help you work more creatively and efficiently.

You don’t need to overhaul your workflow. Just pick one task—like refining a storyboard, generating distractors, or simplifying content—and give AI a shot. The more you experiment, the more value you’ll find.

In the end, AI isn’t here to replace your expertise. It’s here to support it—one thoughtful, time-saving idea at a time.
 

Related Posts:

How to Customize ChatGPT to Get the Results You Want

d’Vinci’s Use of Generative AI Tools: Our Company Point-of-View (POV)

Learn more about Canvas by OpenAI

The integration of Artificial Intelligence (AI) into Learning and Development (L&D) has sparked a mixture of excitement and concern among professionals and clients alike. This article aims to dispel any doubts by illustrating the nuanced, irreplaceable value that expert instructional design professionals bring, and how AI-equipped L&D can elevate learning experiences by enhancing personalization, efficiency, and outcomes.

AI Through a Bloom's Lens: Novice vs. Expert Instructional Designers

Let's think about AI in terms instructional design professionals will understand, Bloom’s taxonomy. We'll assume novice instructional designers have foundational level skill and knowledge. They can remember and explain learning strategies, but do not apply all of them. So, they might utilize AI tools to generate instructional content and package it into learning activities, but their engagement with AI stops there. This approach, while efficient, only scratches the surface of what's possible. 

In stark contrast, expert instructional designers, backed by years of experience and a deep understanding of educational principles, delve deeper. They not only generate content using AI but also critically engage with it, 'Applying', 'Analyzing', 'Evaluating', and 'Creating' new engaging learning experiences that go above and beyond what they had the time or opportunity to create before AI. This is where the value lies for you: The expert's (your!) ability to engineer effective prompts, assess AI outputs for alignment with educational goals, and evaluate their real-world efficacy in learning contexts.  

Scenario Spotlight: Autism Awareness

As an example of deeper engagement with AI, I recently utilized ChatGPT to transform foundational knowledge about interactions between security guards and people on the autism spectrum into engaging educational content. The AI helped create targeted knowledge check questions and scenario-based exercises that reflect real-life situations, ensuring that security personnel are well-prepared to recognize and respond appropriately to people on the autism spectrum.

AI can be instrumental in developing interactive learning activities and simulations designed to enhance communication skills and de-escalation techniques. By integrating AI into the curriculum development process, we can streamline the creation of a dynamic and impactful training program. In this case AI contributed to the significant advancement of a specialized security training.

The Value of Human Expertise in AI-Equipped Instructional Design

Investing in expert instructional design services ensures that the learning solutions developed for your team become transformative experiences that foster real skill development and performance improvement. While AI can provide data and draft content, it lacks the ability to understand your unique organizational culture, empathize with individual learner needs, and inspire change — crucial elements that expert instructional designers bring to the table.

Conclusion: AI as a Tool, Not a Replacement

It's not just about using advanced tools; it's about going deeper to apply them wisely and effectively to achieve your specific goals. The nuanced, critical, and creative engagement that expert instructional designers bring is the key to unlocking the true potential of AI in education, ensuring that your team is not just informed but transformed.

As you ponder the future of L&D, consider how the combination of AI and human insight could revolutionize your approaches. Remember, the irreplaceable value of human expertise, when blended with AI, can lead to unparalleled learning outcomes. 

Call to Action:

Instructional design professionals who not only use AI but also enhance its output with their expertise, will help ensure that L&D initiatives are as effective, relevant, and impactful as possible. In the evolving landscape of L&D, expert instructional designers ensure that AI is not a threat but a powerful ally in developing a skilled, adaptable, and future-ready workforce.

AI isn't just a change in tools; it's a transformative shift in how we approach L&D – a shift that can shape a future where AI and human expertise combine to create a more informed, adaptable, and skilled workforce.

Related article: How AI is Transforming the Innovation Landscape in Learning and Development, by Mason Scuderi

Finding the right eLearning partner can be stressful and time consuming. In our latest eBook, written by d'Vinci President Mason Scuderi and me, we breakdown seven-steps to simplify the selection process and hear advice from corporate leaders on the qualities to look for in a potential vendor. 

Download 7 Steps to Selecting the Right eLearning Vendor

Gamification can create engaging learning experiences that increase learning and retention. Intel’s Learning & Development Consultant Usha Chazhiyat shares best practices for any organization looking to integrate gamification into the learning experience. She also offers advice on how to get started and build on learning solutions that leverage technology to teach.

 

 

 

Show Notes:

Intel’s Usha Chazhiyat has develop a recipe for successfully using gamification to engage and educate learners. She offers advice on how to get started and build on learning solutions that leverage technology to teach.

• Start using gamification in a small pilot project to see what works with your learners before incorporating into more eLearning.
• Use a variety of gaming techniques such as trivia games, to more complex scenario-based experiences.
• Try to create new learning experiences using previous templates when developing new courses with gamification. 
• Consider a variety of gamification approaches to meet the different educational needs of your learners.

About Usha Chazhiyat:

Usha Chazhiyat is the learning innovation strategist for Intel Corporation and is passionate about utilizing technology and immersive methodologies to build engaging and effective learning experiences for adult learners. Usha is a former software engineer turned learning leader and has many achievements in leading organizational efforts in learning at Intel to adopt engaging learning trends including gamified learning. She has 16 years of experience working with Fortune 500 companies like Intel Corporation and Hewlett Packard in building expertise through people management, project management and software engineering.

Learn more about Karl Kapp’s book mentioned in this episode. The Gamification of Learning and Instruction Fieldbook: Ideas into Practice 

Learn more about using Articulate Storyline 360 mentioned by Usha as a gamification development tool. 

See how we partner with Sandy Hook Promise.

Explore adult and K12 educational outreach on SandyHookPromise.org 

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Transcript:

Female Presenter: [00:00:00] This is Powered by Learning, a podcast designed for learning leaders, to hear the latest approaches to creating learning experiences that engage learners and achieve improved performance for individuals and organizations.

Male Presenter: Powered by Learning is brought to you by d'Vinci Interactive. For more than 25 years, d'Vinci has provided custom learning solutions to government agencies, corporations, medical education and certification organizations, and educational content providers. We collaborate with our clients to bring order and clarity to content and technology. Learn more at dvinci.com.

Susan Cort: Hello, and welcome to Powered by Learning. I'm your host Susan Cort. Today I'm joined by d'Vinci CEO, Luke Kempski, and our guest Usha Chazhiyat, a learning and development consultant with Intel Corporation. Usha joins us from our office in Oregon to talk about using gamification to create effective learning experiences. Welcome, Usha.

Usha Chazhiyat: [00:01:00]Thank you so much. Happy to be here.

Luke Kempski: Glad you could join us, Usha.

Susan: Usha, start off by telling us a little bit about your career journey and your role at Intel.

Usha: Absolutely. From an education background, I come from a bachelor's in computer technology, and I used to work as a software engineer in my previous life, as I think about it. Also, my journey, I've done software development, quality testing, team lead. There was a point in my career where I really started thinking about what am I really passionate about. Thinking differently, thinking about a career move, and one thing that I always enjoyed in my life as a software engineer was really training my people, as we onboard folks into our team, training them, getting them close to their work and job.

I'm always passionate about technology. I think that comes from my software background. That is where I started exploring instructional design as an area of career focus. I went back, got [00:02:00] my certification in instructional design and technology from San Diego State University, and joined Intel into the sales and marketing organization as their learning design and development specialist.

From there, I was with that organization for seven years where I got the opportunity to implement a lot of these amazing capabilities. From there, I moved into supporting learning strategy and execution for data center and AI, one of the growing business units within Intel. That's where I'm right now.

Luke: That's so great. I would imagine everybody's jealous on the podcast about the opportunity to create e-learning and training with someone with a software development background. I know a lot of organizations, Usha, really want to bring gamification into their learning offering to the learning experiences they create, but sometimes they have trouble getting started. Talk about how gamification has evolved at Intel and how you've been involved in that.

Usha: Yes, certainly. [00:03:00] As I think about it, we have been hearing about gamification a whole lot, right? It's, I would say, a hot trend in the industry. Everybody is trying to do that, but the concept of gamification in learning is still new as I see it. Even though it's being applied in many organizations in small fashions, it's not a key belief yet, as I would say, like any other Zoom-based training or on-demand training.

The evolution for gamified learning within Intel did take some time. It was a process as I would call it. The first time when I started leading this project, there was a lot of need for research and education. The initial efforts, I still remember almost 6 to 12 months was spent in building that awareness to this methodology, getting our stakeholders and subject matter experts see that vision through us.

I've done things like bringing industry experts for webinar, [00:04:00] managing small focus group sessions where we just brainstorm and ideate. How can we apply this into practice? That helped us bring a lot of use cases into place. That also helped our subject matter experts to think about these concepts, our facilitators, there are so many that come into play.

Once this awareness get built, and once you start seeing more and more people engaged in the conversation and coming up ready to partner with you, it is about finding that right sponsor and get the right leadership support that we need because amplifying a message like any other innovation and getting that sponsor to be your-- I would almost call it backbone support when you learn something of these. To me, that was my second phase, who can be my leadership partner, who can be my leadership sponsor.

Once you figure out some of those details, it is actually time to implement a pilot. Like any other innovation, [00:05:00] like I mentioned, gamified learning is still new. It is hard for everybody to see that vision. How can you lead the way by showing small examples, putting small pilots into place, getting that feedback from your learners, which you can then use to amplify your own message?

To me, it is almost like a three-step process. The first one is building that awareness and get more and more support from different organizations, industry leaders to get that message across. The second one is helping our subject matter experts think by coming together, building use cases, putting small pilots. The third big critical piece is getting that commitment and sponsor from the leadership team who can help you amplify the message.

Luke: Yes, that's a really great approach and I could see how it's really progressed in your organization. Where you are at this point, are you creating full courses that are gamified, or is it more-- you have a course, you have the content delivered in one way and it's more about application [00:06:00] and practice?

Usha: We really started off with application and practice because that was an easy achievable goal for us. The efforts that I've led actually went through all the different levels of, let's say, Bloom's taxonomy, remembering facts and figures using gamification for many application-level trainings. We really started off by application into more of a recall effort because that was easy to implement. Right now within Intel, there are a lot of use cases where we are using the methodology overall in a curriculum journey to encourage more learning and practice. Yes, we started off with actually the application level.

Luke: That makes sense as well. Now that you're creating different types of games, how do you decide what concept to go with? What are the kinds of things that you think about when you determine what the gamification experience is going to be like for the learner?

Usha: Yes, and the way that I see it [00:07:00] is you're actually putting two different hats when you decide to make some of these decisions. One is, bring your expert learning designer who can help you define what are the objectives and the goals. These two should go together. The second one is really about bringing our game design experts to bring that experience in a best-suited way.

We actually go through a really core design development process, where in the design process we think about, "Okay, what are the learning objectives to achieve? What are the games that could go into these areas?" The way that we make our decision is, for example, let's say I'm designing a game approach to achieve a goal where my learners at the end of the course are able to state at least 5 colors of the 15 that they learn. Just a very simple core remember type of level, right?

For that, we don't need to craft a scenario-based game [00:08:00] or a role-play-based game. It can just be, "How can you help your learner to recall the facts faster?" Maybe we'll go for a trivia kind of approach because all we are trying to get is for them to be thinking about these things as fast as possible, versus we have implemented cases where, let's say, you are trying to or facilitating a learning experience for somebody to communicate in a certain way based upon different situations. They have to really take the learnings from their communication classrooms and actually apply it to different situations.

We might design a game where it is role play-based, and it is very timed. Then you go from one station to the next station, putting your learning into practice in five minutes, and you get 10 points, for example. So I think it's really upon what learning objective it is. I have to say, it's not a straightforward answer, but a lot of things go into practice. [00:09:00] We have actually done trivia for scenario-based questions. I'm not saying it is not possible, but as long as you're achieving that learning objective, to me, what game you craft can be somewhat flexible, but then there are so many resources.

I always go with Karl Kapp's book, Gamification as a Field Guide, I think, I don't know if I'm saying the title wrong, but it's an amazing book. It has a big-blown chart about which type of learning and what kind of games can be recommended. Going through some of those will actually help.

The one last point is you have to really connect it back to your audience. Not all games connect to everybody and also the time. For the application level example, you might not really have the time to build a full-fledge scenario-based game. Then how can you use trivia and use it in the right way so the learning goal is achieved? Yes, so many different [00:10:00] ways, but I think enough time dedicated in that design process actually affects the success of everything.

Luke: That's a really good point, and I know some of the instructional designers may be concerned about how much time it's going to take to create a game. Can you talk a little bit about the tools you're using and maybe any of the processes you're using to make development more efficient?

Usha: Definitely. A couple of tools that we have, when you do the design phase, the design phase, we have our own-- we use Excel sheets, right? Everybody likes it. We use Excel sheets to actually coordinate many of these different concepts, so we'll have the Excel sheets that our learning designers will put the structure of the class, what are the intended outcomes, which the game designers can actually take and incorporate a structure for a game, build a story that can expand to the content and all of that.

Our basic tool is Excel sheet all through for the design phase, [00:11:00] and then we also have, based upon what games that we are-- we have started reusing the game templates that we did. Each game template have an intake tool, an intake Excel sheet that displays what is a story, what is it that you need to change, and what are the questions? Excel sheet is one of our go-to during design phase, and the efforts that I led, and I'm not saying this is common for all Intel, but the efforts that I led, we have used a lot of articulate storyline.

One, mainly because of the need for scale, we didn't want to introduce a new tool that is difficult for our instructional designers or our game designers. We go with an articulate storyline and you can actually embed Javascript code to make it more functional, similar to software. That helped us create a lot of templates right now that we can reuse in many different cases. I know within Intel, there are other tools that are getting used, but this is what I go with [00:12:00] mostly.

Luke: Excellent, great. Now that you've put some games out with your learners, how are they using them? What kind of feedback are you getting, and are you able to measure any of the impact?

Usha: Yes. I have to talk about the initial reactions that our learners had when we implemented the pilot. The first time we implemented the approach, and maybe the current situation with everything going virtual helped us, maybe that is the case. We put it together with the core idea that we have to-- there's a real need to give a different varied experience for our learners. We hear about Zoom fatigue, we hear about virtual training fatigue, and those are really real when you look at corporate trainings.

We started off by, "Okay, let's put this idea out there, and see how our audience respond." The way that we measured our initial pilot success was one very much into reaction-based assessment, like, [00:13:00] "How do you like about it? How did it help you to learn?" Those kinds of questions. Also, since we developed the games using storyline, we had the capability to analyze the points from a score database. We had all of our games connected back to a score database and tracked how the points are getting increased and how many times each learner played. To me, those are real successes because we are seeing more and more learners coming back, playing the game, and more practice helps you learn as well.

Then we also had focus group and one-on-one meetings that I've set with folks to really understand what is it in this game that you enjoyed. It's not just to say yes and no. Would you like to see more of this? What are the different areas that you see this being applicable? We had survey-based feedback, we had focus group-based [00:14:00] feedback. We also had the capability to go in the back-end to see how a learner was progressing step by step. These are all good data points that we can go and showcase to our leadership, to the new initiative saying, "Okay, here is what we learned."

Luke: That's great. I know it's always fun to talk to learners directly who've taken your courses or experiences you've created and hear that firsthand feedback.

Usha: Yes, definitely.

Luke: Beyond gamification and the learning experiences, also do you have any gamification in the curriculum or in your LMS to basically challenge learners to complete multiple courses and learning experiences that are out there?

Usha: There are efforts I would say within Intel where gamification approach is being used within the curriculum to motivate learners to take more classes and all that. There are different use cases where we are applying the approach, yes.

Luke: Okay, great. I know that with your technology background [00:15:00] and your passion for technology and learning, talk about your views on other types of immersive technologies whether it's VR or AR. Where do you think they fit now and do you expect this to change in the near future?

Usha: My personal viewpoint on that is, and I am a big promoter of technology and I've been part of projects where we use virtual reality to enhance a learning experience, I see two ways. The first one is where it actually makes the most impact is in the soft skills areas. Honestly, this is my viewpoint because the potential of virtual reality is to put you in a situation and to practice in a safe space. You can build a situation as if you're going to apply this in front of a customer or a stakeholder and then practice in a safe space so that you can revise and go back and redo your practice.

I think that a practice-based approach [00:16:00] is where the VR capability is ideal in my viewpoint. I know we use VR to-- well, not Intel, but I've done pilots where we try to use VR in teaching about Intel product information that's factual-based. To me, that is the first step in, but the actual potential is where you can help learners practice using these technologies and simulated environments.

Luke: Excellent. With your point of view when it comes to gamification and all the learning that you've done around it and how you've been able to apply your software development skills, it seems like you're always trying to take the learning experience to another level. What inspires you to want to do that?

Usha: The way that I started this journey, I mean, we always talk about how can we bring new experiences for our learners, but I do believe in this one core concept that all of us learn differently. I have two kids, [00:17:00] if I look at either of them, one, I mean this kid loves to practice, always into practice mode, getting perfection, the second one, not so much. The second one is a different type of learning.

When I look at-- that's the same case with adults as well. When I look at people around me, each of us have different ways of learning, and each of us approach our own learning in different ways. We have done a couple of surveys within Intel as well to understand what people's learning style is even though that is a big known-- well, that is not a big known thing in the industry, like what are different learning styles?

Every time we do the survey, it comes out with multiple different styles. My concept is that a one-size-fits-all methodology for corporations might not be effective. We always go with, "Okay, Zoom-based learning, let's show a set of PowerPoints, and on-demand training with 30 to 60 minutes just talking in the [00:18:00] background."

To me, we don't know if that works. Yes, it scales better, but I like to look at it from a learner standpoint and acknowledge the fact that everybody learns differently. There is a potential opportunity for these different types of experience to access with the right understanding that a subset of your learners might like one way versus a subset might like a different base. How can we as learning designers and learning innovators be that voice for our learners to bring these new methodologies and technologies into place so that learning is actually inclusive? To me, that is a big piece.

Luke: That's such a great answer. When you think about all the different learning styles and to really be able to offer different approaches and different experiences for the learner, you hit as many of those as possible. Today, we got to really reach the people who are attracted to podcasts and like to learn from audio. So great to have your [00:19:00] expertise shared with us, Usha. Wish you the best of luck with continuing to create great learning experiences and using the technology to enhance learning for all the learners in Intel.

Usha: Awesome. Thank you so much for the opportunity.

Susan: Thank you, Usha. Just great advice and thank you for sharing your passion. I think it's good advice for everyone listening. You don't have to be Intel in order to infuse some of these great learning strategies to make a difference, so thank you. Usha certainly shared some compelling ways that gamification can engage learners and drive better learning outcomes.

Luke: Yes, for sure. She's certainly full of passion too for engaging all types of learners, and she's really used gamification to do this at Intel. She talked about how gamification evolved at Intel, starting with research and planning to small pilot projects, and then to more widespread use today. She talked about the range of games they are adopting from trivia games to more complex role-based games and [00:20:00] scenario-based approaches. As they've developed more gamified learning experiences, they've been able to recreate and reuse templates, so they can be more efficient when developing new courses. She also talked about how she matches the gamification approach to address different learning needs.

Usha's experience as a software developer combined with her instructional design knowledge really threads through all of the different perspectives she shared. She has positive views on how technology can be used to create experiences that are inclusive of all types of learners. I can really see Usha becoming more widely recognized as both a creator of learning experiences and a thought leader in our industry.

Susan: She was definitely inspirational and had some great advice for our listeners. Thanks, Luke. Anything new at d'Vinci that you'd like to share?

Luke: Oh, yes, I did want to take a minute to spotlight our client Sandy Hook Promise. In the context of recent news, their work is more important than ever. They've created this kind of amazing learning center [00:21:00] where educators, students, and parents can access materials designed to help prevent acts of violence in schools, homes, and communities. At d'Vinci, we've worked closely with them to create fun K1-2 learning experiences that teach students to reach out and include peers, who are lonely and isolated.

We've also created learning experiences that teach students to recognize someone who may be at risk of hurting themselves or others and to know how to say something to a trusted adult. Now, I really recommend to our listeners to check out sandyhookpromise.org and learn more about their mission and their educational programs.

Susan: They're also very active on social media. I would add to that list for people to check them out on social. They've got some great resources and ways that people can get involved in their organization.

Luke: Hopefully, we can have a guest from there someday soon on Powered by Learning.

Susan: That sounds like a great idea. Well, thanks, Luke. Many thanks to Usha Chazhiyat, learning and development consultant at Intel, for [00:22:00] joining us today. If you have any questions about what we talked about, you can reach out to us on d'Vinci social channels through our website dVinci.com or by emailing us at poweredbylearning@d'Vinci.com.

Male Presenter: Powered by Learning is brought to you by d'Vinci Interactive. For more than 25 years, d'Vinci has provided custom learning solutions to government agencies, corporations, medical education and certification organizations, and educational content providers. We collaborate with our clients to bring order and clarity to content and technology. Learn more at dVinci.com.

Educating the public requires an integrated approach to engage and inform so that’s why POZ Magazine leveraged online assessment tools and eLearning courses to educate people living with and affected by HIV/AIDS. Ian Anderson, president of Smart + Strong, and Oriol Gutierrez, editorial director for Smart + Strong and editor-in-chief for POZ Magazine join us with more. 

Show Notes:

Ian Anderson and Oriol Gutierrez from POZ Magazine use eLearning as one way to reach the public. They offer tips about their ongoing journey to educate a global audience.

•  Providing eLearning modules and self-assessment tools was a logical next step to engage and educate the public.
• eLearning created another avenue to complement the website, magazine and other educational resources by providing learning on demand.
• Using relatable images in the eLearning modules helps make complex subject matter more understandable. 

Learn more about POZ Magazine 

Read about d’Vinci’s work for POZ 

Discover more about Unlocking Life’s Code, the educational website mentioned at the end of the podcast. 

Powered by Learning earned an Award of Distinction in the Podcast/Audio category from The Communicator Awards and a Silver Davey Award for Educational Podcast. The podcast is also named to Feedspot's Top 40 L&D podcasts and Training Industry’s Ultimate L&D Podcast Guide.

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Transcript

Susan: [00:00:00] This is Powered by Learning, a podcast designed for learning leaders to hear the latest approaches to creating learning experiences that engage learners and achieve improved performance for individuals and organizations.

Speaker 1: Powered by Learning is brought to you by d'Vinci Interactive. For more than 25 years, d'Vinci has provided custom learning solutions to government agencies, corporations, medical education and certification organizations, and educational content providers. We collaborate with our clients to bring order and clarity to content and technology. Learn more at dvinci.com.

Susan: Hello, and welcome to Powered by Learning. I'm your host, Susan Cort. Today, I'm joined by d'Vinci president, Mason Scuderi, and our guest, Ian Anderson, president of Smart and Strong, and Oriol Gutierrez, editorial director for Smart and Strong, and editor-in-chief for POZ magazine, a national award-winning magazine and website for people living with and affected by HIV/AIDS.

[00:01:00]

POZ Magazine and poz.com reach more than 70% of all people living in the United States who are aware that they are HIV positive. The magazine and the website are also read by people who wish to know more about the disease, people who are considering getting tested for the disease, and many healthcare providers. Today, we're going to talk about one of the ways POZ engages their target audience through online assessment tools and eLearning courses. Welcome, Ian and Oriol.

Mason: Thanks for joining us.

Ian: I'm looking forward to our conversation.

Oriol: Good to be here.

Susan: Ian, let's start off by giving us a little bit of an overview of Smart and Strong and one of your brands, POZ.

Ian: Smart and Strong was created a little over 27 years ago as a health-focused media brand that started with POZ, our biggest and oldest brand for people living with HIV. At the time, living with HIV and AIDS was thought of as a death sentence. [00:02:00] Sean Strub, our founder felt that he needed to change the dialogue. He created a glossy magazine, and he made it about living with HIV. He put people out camping going to the beach. Again, it was truth-telling as well. It was not only showing people living with the disease, but it was also explaining the treatment options and how to care for each other. That mantra has really carried through everything that we've done since and all of our other brands as well.

Susan: You think about the shift in thinking from people early on probably focusing on dying from AIDS, but your magazine helped people understand how to live with AIDS, or you'll talk a little bit about that and the many ways in which poz.com and POZ magazine has impacted so many lives over almost 28 years.

Oriol: I was one of them. I was a reader before I ever dreamed of becoming part of the staff. I tested positive with HIV in 1992. [00:03:02] I was 22 years old. I thought I'd be dead by the age of 30. That's a pretty typical story from people of my era. I stumbled onto the magazine at a clinic at about maybe two or three issues after I actually saw the magazine launch. It was a pretty amazing thing literally to see hope. I've been a fan ever since, so the idea that I sit in this chair. Sometimes, I pinch myself. It's a pretty extraordinary journey.

Mason: Thanks for that background, Ian and Oriol. We're very proud to partner with you in the creation of eLearning and the assessment tools that you use at POZ. For our listeners, a little bit of background, the project was funded by the National Library of Medicine and its ongoing AIDS community outreach program. In partnership with POZ and Smart and Strong, d'Vinci created eight eLearning modules to help people concerned about HIV/AIDS self-assess the risk [00:04:00] and determine if they need to seek medical help. What was the motivation for expanding the digital magazine to include eLearning modules, Ian?

Ian: Over our 27 years, we've always prided ourselves on bringing information to people wherever they might need it, and in whatever format we could to make it digestible and understandable to the community. In the beginning, it was a print. Then, we moved to the online, www.poz.com. We moved into social media. I was part of our first MySpace website if anybody remembers MySpace back in the day. We continued to evolve, Facebook, Tumblr, Twitter, et cetera.

For us, it's always been about trying to find new tools, new ways to help people understand what can be very complicated information. HIV, fortunately, it has gotten a little bit easier over the years. It used to be you'd have all kinds of pill combinations and trying to keep it all straight was very difficult. [00:05:00] Now, there still are lots of different options and opportunities if someone's living with HIV.

We were looking for a way to continue to expand that, find a new way to help people understand these different things, assessment of risk, figure out what treatment should you start with, learn about aging with HIV, which is a whole another topic that we covered in an eLearning module. We were fortunate enough to partner with d'Vinci and get this grant for the first round of modules. It's a great new way to educate and bring information to our audience, someone who may not be comfortable with the words. It's a long sentences, long paragraphs. It's just all words. This has pictures. It has people. It has personal stories in it and has a really nice easy-to-use function.

Mason: That's great and showing some of the benefits and strengths of an eLearning [00:06:00] module. Oriol, with years of experience as an editor and writer, and knowing how to connect with your readers, how did you translate that understanding into creating impactful eLearning?

Oriol: Being said, a lot of the touchstones that are in these modules are pretty great as far as people who need to learn differently or quite frankly, just anybody [chuckles]. Reading straight words, as Ian put it, can be daunting to digest difficult topics. We talk about reaching our audience by not only educating but entertaining. I think that sometimes raises an eyebrow with people because they don't really think of learning as something that should be fun. It should be dry and boring, and that's just not my philosophy, certainly. I don't think it's ours as a company.

It's a lot more effective when you can engage people where they are and perhaps where they aspire to be. [00:07:00] Pretty pictures and happy people go a long way toward making topics that could be scary or seemingly unapproachable that much more approachable, but it's not just the visuals. It's also the way that things are written, the way that things are presented. They make a big difference.

Mason: That's really great. At d'Vinci, we're always interested in addition to our clients being interested and measuring the learning outcomes that come from the experiences that we create, with POZ, how do you measure the engagement with these eLearning modules that are housed within the POZ website?

Ian: POZ has always engaged our audience with whatever types of tools and learning products that we provide. It was a very easy and seamless process to introduce these modules and do the same. We have the traditional Google analytics on the modules, so we can track how many people have [00:08:00] viewed each page of the module, how long they're spending with the module.

We also end with a survey. We have been surveying our audience from the beginning. They're very comfortable telling us what they think in very plain language to put it politely. [crosstalk] We have a survey at the end of these and the feedback on them has been amazing. People have really enjoyed them, appreciate the learning. We also link people within the modules to more information that's something else POZ has always done. Whether you are online or in print, or you see one of our posters up at an ASO, an AIDS Service Organization office around the country, we link you back to the community.

If you want to talk more about aging with HIV, you can go to the POZ forums and get more information. The engagement and making it fun and interesting, as Oriol said, is something that has always been part of our learning. [00:09:00] It's funny. As Oriol said, we make it fun. You're not really necessarily realizing you're learning, but at the end of the day, you've got a lot more knowledge on the topic.

Mason: Oh, that's so great to hear that the learning modules have been well received.

Susan: Do you find, Ian, when you're doing these surveys, are you ever getting ideas from people who've taken some of the learning for new ideas for content or ways to improve it? Are you learning from the learners?

Ian: I think Oriol might be better to answer that because he's the one who gets the poll results and the survey results and turns them into all kinds of projects.

Oriol: The short answer is, absolutely. [laughs] Our audience teaches us as much as we dare to teach them. It's a very interesting dynamic in the HIV community anyway where folks especially who have been living with the virus for a long time, so we've called them long-term survivors. They had to learn things from scratch. I barely qualify although I've been living with the virus for about 30 years [00:10:00] as a long-term survivor by some other standards, and they thought they'd be gone a long time ago.

The way they survived was actually to start reading POZ magazine [chuckles] and other magazines like it and tear out pages from the treatment section and run to their doctor and say, "Have you ever heard about this?" Most of the time they'd say, "I never heard that before." They became the experts, way before the medical establishment did. Actually, we are very humbled to get their feedback, and as Ian said oftentimes very colorfully [laughs] but they teach us just as much as we teach them.

Mason: It's great to hear that the e-learning modules are being well received by your audience. Often, organizations try to educate the public with one-way learning or just a basic information dump, but not many are willing to go to the length to create e-learning and assessment tools. Why do you think it's so important for POZ, and what advice could you give to others trying to affect change?

[00:10:57]

Ian: POZ, as I think I said earlier in the podcast, we've always prided ourselves on trying to bring the information to wherever people are engaging with it. A good example was there's a social media site called Tumblr. High schoolers were using it to learn about HIV maybe 10 years ago. One of our junior staff brought it to us and say, "Hey, I'm seeing this conversation going," so we created a Tumblr page. Our junior staffers started to engage people in that space. That's something that has been part of our organization from the beginning.

We're also very fortunate that we have really engaged editors. When someone comes to our Facebook page and asks a question, we have an editor there to respond to it. We also have forums where there's 24/7 monitoring from around the world. If somebody comes on there and has a problem or an issue, we can answer the question there very quickly. Bringing it back to the e-learning modules, it's just another component of what we [00:12:00] do. We're trying to get people to ask questions. We're trying to basically empower them to go forward whether it's to their doctor or to their place of work and be empowered to discuss HIV and what they need or what they want.

The advice is really just to engage people wherever you might find them looking for your information. Again, HIV, it started in print and moved to digital, and moved to social media and now, we've got these great e-learning tools that walk people through scenarios so that they can learn and figure out what's best for them in whatever situation they find themselves. Again, I want to stress the importance of the editors being involved. Oriol's here, so I'll let him speak to that directly but having an editorial team so engaged is a huge benefit for what we do and strongly recommend any organization do that, have the editors on the forefront talking directly to the community.

[00:12:59]

Oriol: Yes, I couldn't agree more. There's a certain way of doing things that certainly a lot of publishing companies but I would say all companies follow, and it's a top-down model. For at least our editorial team, we try to have a different approach and empower everyone to have a certain level of responsibility and engagement. That just proves to be effective for us.

Mason: Oh, that's some really great feedback. No matter what content we're creating, there's nothing better than knowing that that content is reaching your audience and then receiving some feedback from your audience. Thank you both for sharing. Before you leave us, Ian and Oriol, talk a little bit about what's next for POZ.

Ian: We are keeping our eyes open for what the community needs next in whatever format it might come. One thing we are actively working on is evolving our video content. We've been creating videos for years, whether it's sharing video from community events or [00:14:00] people telling their stories, but we think there is more we can do with the platform. For instance, we offer a wide variety of tips for the community whether it's eating healthy or ways to reduce your stress.

One specific tips list that we have been working around and updating is around PrEP. PrEP, just as background, it stands for pre-exposure prophylaxis, and it's an HIV prevention tool. If you are not living with HIV, it reduces the risk of transmission if you're exposed to HIV. There's actually a new injectable option that goes along with the pills that have been around for years. People have a lot of questions - the pros, the cons, the pills versus shot. We already do present them in a bunch of different ways but I think that video is an important option to add into that mix. We're talking to a couple of different vendors about ways to make that happen. That's my big priority at the moment. Oriol, do you have any thoughts on your side?

[00:14:59]

Oriol: Sure. We are still living through the COVID era and probably will for some time. There are a lot of connections between COVID and HIV as far as the science goes. There's a lot of interesting connections there and certainly, editorially we'll be following those.

Susan: Anything new on the learning horizon, Oriol, that you can see doing to educate your readers?

Oriol: Besides video, I am actually looking forward to doing some more modules. I do think they're fun. They are engaging in a way that I find to be unique so I look forward to doing more of those. Apart from that, I look forward to hearing from our audience. I'm sure they'll have some opinions about what they want.

Mason: Our audience is keeping us on the cutting edge. That's for sure.

Susan: Thank you both for taking the time to talk with Mason and me today. It was really interesting to hear about your journey with POZ over the last 27-plus years. We're excited to play a very small part in helping to educate [00:16:00] your audience and look forward to hearing what's next, so thank you.

Mason: Thanks for having us.

Oriol: Thank you.

Mason: Thank you both.

Susan: It's so inspirational to hear how e-learning has played a part in actually shaping the lives of people living with or affected by HIV/AIDS. What are some of your key takeaways from our conversation with Ian and Oriol?

Mason: Susan, that was an impactful conversation. Ian and Oriol's shared some great insights with us about how to educate the public on health-related content. I really liked the importance of using relatable characters, scenarios in writing to engage and entertain your audience. Also, using a variety of different formats like eLearning modules, websites, forums, and anywhere that your audience is, finding a way to reach them.

Susan: Well put. Anything new at d'Vinci that you'd like to share?

Mason: d'Vinci recently redesigned and upgraded an educational website for the National Human Genome Research Institute. The NHGRI is one of 27 institutes [00:17:00] at the National Institutes of Health. Unlocking Life's Code was originally an educational website launched in 2013 as a part of the collaboration with the Smithsonian Institution, and what they were doing there is in launching that website was celebrating the 10-year anniversary of the decoding of the human genome. Recently d'Vinci redesigned and redeveloped Unlocking Life's Code.

We used our learning-focused UI, UX process to organize information based on user personas. We upgraded the website from Drupal 7 to Drupal 9. We organized a variety of online educational resources, learning modules, videos, 3D animations, PDFs into a searchable resource library. Finally, we translated the website and educational materials into Spanish in order to reach a wider range of learners.

Susan: That sounds great Mason, I'll definitely have to put a link to that in the show notes of this podcast. Thanks, Mason. Many [00:18:00] thanks to Ian Anderson and Oriol Gutierrez for joining us today. If you have any questions about what we talked about, you can reach out to us on d'Vinci social channels through our website dvinci.com or by emailing us at poweredbylearning@dvinci.com.

Speaker 1: Powered by learning is brought to you by d'Vinci interactive. For more than 25 years, d'Vinci has provided custom learning solutions to government agencies, corporations, medical education and certification organizations, and educational content providers. We collaborate with our clients to bring order and clarity to content and technology. Learn more at dvinci.com.

[00:18:41]

Training Industry has named d’Vinci Interactive to its 2022 Top Training Companies™ Watch List for Custom Content Development.

d’Vinci develops learning experiences, educational websites and web and mobile applications for corporate, government, medical and K-12 educational content clients.

“We’re honored to be recognized for developing outstanding custom learning solutions. Our talented team is focused on creating extraordinary learning outcomes for our valued partners and clients,” said d’Vinci President Mason Scuderi.

“The emerging companies chosen for our Custom Content Development Watch List create a learning environment with their comprehensive solutions to align with business objectives,” said Tom Whelan, director of corporate research at Training Industry, Inc. “These companies create this learning environment through developing engaging content with the latest learning technologies in gamification, eLearning and virtual training.”

The Content Development Watch List includes two dozen companies that demonstrate excellence in innovation, impact and industry visibility, capability to develop and deliver multiple types of eLearning content, depth and breadth of subject matter expertise, company size and growth potential, quality of clients and geographic reach.

Training Industry, the leading research and information resource for corporate learning leaders, prepares the Training Industry Top 20 report on critical sectors of the corporate training marketplace to better inform professionals about the best and most innovative providers of training services and technologies.

 

About Training Industry, Inc.

Training Industry is the most trusted source of information on the business of learning. Our authority is built on deep ties with more than 450 expert contributors who share insights and actionable information with their peers. Training Industry’s courses, live events, articles, magazine, webinars, podcast, research and reports generate more than 10 million industry interactions each year, while the Top 20 Training Companies Lists help business leaders find the right training partners.

The Pennsylvania Department of Drug and Alcohol Programs (DDAP) has selected d’Vinci Interactive’s ecoLearn® Learning Management System (LMS) to be its Integrated System for the Management and Administration of Requisite Training (iSMART).  The web-based system will be used to manage all aspects of DDAP’s robust training program for professionals in the field of gambling and substance use disorder.

Awarded to d’Vinci parent company, JPL, the contract will be implemented with a seamless team from JPL and d’Vinci along with diverse business Momentum and veteran-owned business SQN Systems. The customized solution will serve more than 14,000 students, faculty, county authorities, facility administrators, and DDAP fiscal, training, and administrative staff.  

The ecoLearn® LMS has been upgraded and used by the Pennsylvania Chiefs of Police for over 10 years and has recently been implemented for the Northeast Counterdrug Training Center (NCTC) and the Western Regional Counterdrug Training Center (WRCTC).

Learn more about d'Vinci's ecoLearn® Learning Management System (LMS). 

Keeping the learner in mind when designing eLearning courses is key to engaging them and driving organizational success. Highmark Health's Learning Architect Angela Sample, Ph.D.  discusses best practices for using empathetic principles in instructional design.

Show Notes:

• Empathetic principles can be complementary to learning experience design principles 
• Focus on the importance of designing a solution that's human-centered to truly engage learners.
• Create learner profiles that consider the learner's feelings. Then, be willing to pivot your training approach to align with their cognitive and emotional states. 
• Communicate to management that creating training with the learner in mind will actually yield better ROI.

Powered by Learning earned an Award of Distinction in the Podcast/Audio category from The Communicator Awards and a Silver Davey Award for Educational Podcast. The podcast is also named to Feedspot's Top 40 L&D podcasts and Training Industry’s Ultimate L&D Podcast Guide. 

Learn more about Learning Experience Design referenced in this episode. 

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Transcript:

Voiceover: [00:00] This is Powered by Learning, a podcast designed for learning leaders to hear the latest approaches to creating learning experiences that engage learners and achieve improved performance for individuals and organizations.

Voiceover: Powered by Learning is brought to you by d'Vinci Interactive. For more than 25 years, d'Vinci has provided custom learning solutions to government agencies, corporations, medical education and certification organizations, and educational content providers. We collaborate with our clients to bring order and clarity to content and technology. Learn more at d'Vinci.com.

Susan Cort: Hello, and, and welcome to Powered by Learning. I'm your host Susan Cort, and today I'm joined by d'Vinci Client Solutions Consultant, Angeline Evans, and our guest, Angela Sample. Angela is an award-winning instructional designer and works as a learning architect for Highmark Health, a large healthcare system based in Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania. [01:00] Angela holds a PhD in Instructional Design and has a passion for enabling learners to be successful by applying research to educational trends. Today, we're going to talk to Angela about using empathetic principles in instructional design. Welcome, Angela.

Angeline Evans: Thanks for joining us, Angela.

Angela Sample: Welcome. Thank you so much for having me today.

Susan: Angela, let's start off by giving us a little background on you and your current role.

Angela: Sure. As you mentioned, I am a learning architect at Highmark Health. I have been there for close to eight years and in that role, I have played instructional designer, senior instructional designer, as well as, of course, moved into the learning architect role. Prior to that, I have always been in the design space in some way, shape, or form, working for small and large software companies, and always at the core of that is my love as instructional design. I always laugh and say I love it so much, but that's why I ended up with a PhD in design.

Susan: That's great.

Angeline: That is. [02:00] I'm so excited to chat with you today, Angela, but I feel like there's a lot to cover, so I'm really excited to hear what you have to say, but I thought for some listeners that might not be familiar with the empathetic principles, if you could just start us off and tell us a little bit more about the theory behind it and give us a little 101 that might help guide us tee things off.

Angela: Absolutely. I think what's really important is to level set what it is not and what it's. What it is not is it is not for us to go in and change a learner's entire world because we cannot change the fact that their systems change. We cannot change the fact that their org has changed multiple times or that they're working remotely. What we want to do is we want to make their world a little a bit better. Again, we can't change their entire world; it's just us making the world a little bit better.

The first step in doing that is to shift the focus from a client-centered approach to a learner-centered approach. [02:58] Instead of us always meeting those client needs, which of course we still do want to meet those client needs, we are going to make sure that we're partnering with them and become the trusted advisor to them, and we're actually placing the learner at the center of all that we do. When we do that and we shift the focus, we are actually going to be creating something that meeting the learners' cognitive and emotional needs, so it really is taking care of that learner as a whole.

How we're doing that is we are going to marry a couple of different principles together. We have our user design principles, which are taking care of the learner, learning about the learner. What are the learner's needs? What are the learner's emotional needs? What is their emotional state? Then we're taking that and we're marrying it to instructional design principles.

We're not throwing instructional design principles out the window; we are going to still do task-based analysis. We are going to still do all of our design work, but what doing is we're [04:00] taking what we learned in that user center design process, so again, how is the learner feeling? How do we want them to feel? How are their clients feeling? How do we want their clients to feel? We're taking that whole picture as part of our analysis and then continuing on with the design process.

A very critical point is to ensure that are using the correct design theory or the learning theory to apply to our learning solution. For example, if our learners are feeling very, very anxious and they're nervous, and they're worried about making mistakes, the last thing that we would want to do is make their world worse by creating something that is going to make them more anxious. Something like a conditioning type approach may make them more anxious and make them feel rushed. We would take a different type of learning theory, maybe something constructivist space, for example, that would allow them to take risks and to feel good and feel confidence rather than increase anxiety.

Again, that is the basic theory behind it is marrying, again, user design principles and our instructional design principles, putting the two together to make a learning solution that is going to really enhance the learner's experience. [05:03]

Angeline: Thanks. I really love it's truly holistic, which is really how my beliefs as an instructional designer are. I'm very grounded in this concept that it should be a holistic process. It's so often we hear people talk about content. We say it all the time, people say content is king, but it really should be about the learner at the center. The content, yes, you need to get it to them, but it in order to get it to them in the most effective way, you really should dissect their feelings and create a profile around them.

It's interesting how much you discuss their truly their feelings, their possible anxiety or worries related to a training where oftentimes, I think we see people just look at their demographics, consider maybe [06:00] what technology they use, those top-level traits, and really don't get down to the nitty-gritty of what is this person thinking or feeling or behaving, so thank you for sharing that.

Angela: You're very welcome. That's absolutely true is that when we look at that learner as a whole, especially in 2022, the way that it's progressing is we're wanting really to make it so that it's, again, the best possible experience for them while also, of course, making sure that our client is satisfied.

Angeline: That's going to get-- Ultimately you want to make learners feel empowered and have them be excited about what you're training them on because then that's going to be reinforced memory retention and get them excited to bring it into practice so it makes sense. We should all be doing it, right?

Angela: Yes

Angeline: How did you find yourself, I guess, immersed in this type of research and education around empathy and learning as a learning and development professional? Because I feel like it's a little niche and it's not something that everybody dives into when they're studying this. Tell us your origin story. [07:02]

Angela: I actually have a really good example to share that really sparked my interest. We all have to take those mandatory training, that's a given, and I found myself on a receiving end of a mandatory training that was describing a change. Now, prior to that change, the rumor mill is going, and me included, I'm hearing, as well as my coworkers, we're hearing bits and pieces, so you can imagine. We know a change is coming, we are hearing rumors. Some things are true, not true, not sure. The anxiety is building.

I am taking part of this mandatory online training that e-learning opportunity and I was finding myself getting even more amped up during the training because it was just throwing all these changes at me. I wasn't able to ask questions. I didn't quite understand what it meant for me. [08:00] Why is this happening? What is this really going to mean for me? Then what really, really took it over the edge is that, in order to complete the training remark that I took the training complete, is I had to pass a graded assessment.

It was just a knowledge assessment and it was a way for us to really just regurgitate that we had obtained the information about the changes. It wasn't system-related or anything like that. It was mostly organizational changes. I left that training, I closed out of that training thinking to myself, "Wow, I feel a whole lot worse, first of all, and also, let me reflect and say, well, I create training. I hope I'm not making my learners feel this way."

Angeline: Right?

Angela: Exactly, and what can I do to prevent that? Again you always-

Susan: I was getting anxious just listening to you explain it.

Angeline: I know.

[09:00]

Angela: Yes. It happened to be in my master's classes at the time that this happened. I started doing some research, just say, what are some other ways that we can incorporate? That research just kept snowballing and snowballing. Eventually, I committed myself to say, "I want to do this is my dissertation." I love this topic, I'm so passionate about it, and I'm building this up to say I wasn't able to do my dissertation on this topic.

It was for logistical reasons, not for lack of research or value or anything like that, but I think of it as a blessing because now that I have passed the dissertation process, passed school, passed graduation, and have been through multiple research projects, I can now confidently go in and start to do this type of research at my pace. Not at an academic level pace with professors [10:00] and timestamps and I can actually go and do that. Again, it's a blessing in disguise because now I have that freedom to go do the research the way I want to do it.

Angeline: That is very cool, and that is a good point. Now that we're up to speed on the theory behind everything, let's get tactical. For our listeners that are thinking how can I implement this? It's a great concept, but truly, what steps do we take? Let's consider a scenario. Say a client comes to you and they want to create a training on X, like truly, like on X, Y, Z, what are the first things you do with that client to start creating a training with empathy? Because you had mentioned you still follow the instructional design for process. What additional checkboxes or considerations do you weave in that our listeners could potentially apply tomorrow in the training that they're building?

Angela: Absolutely. That's a great question. The first thing that you have to consider is when working with your clients is that they're going to be a little more cognizant [11:00] of time, value and money. We have to make sure that we head them off, and we talk to them a little bit about the reasons why we are taking this type of approach, and to let them know that it's not going to drag the analysis out for weeks and weeks and weeks, but we do need to obtain this information as part of the analysis process.

As far as what steps would we take, just to reiterate what you said, is we do make sure that we're still doing our regular design duties. We would still do our task-based analysis and our regular learner analysis to find out the context and the situation, the environment. We are going to just add on the user center design principles, which is finding out what is going on with our learners and how can we construct our view to ensure that we are designing for them in mind and making sure that we're meeting those cognitive and emotional needs. [12:00]

As part of our analysis, we need to find out some very simple questions. They go from the for the manager level, the learner level, and of course, the client level. What we would start at with the learner level is how are the learners feeling and how do we want them to feel? Remember, we're not changing their entire world, we are just trying to make their world a little bit better.

If they're already coming in and they're feeling anxious, we know that they're anxious about a change or maybe they're already feeling confident. Then we need to make sure that we're either staying on the right track and making sure that we don't decrease their confidence, or if they're already anxious, how are we not piling on and amping them up and making them even more anxious at the end of that training. We have to make sure that we're understanding that viewpoint.

From the manager viewpoint, we need to understand how are their managers really feeling and how do they feel about their managers? With retention and all of those things [13:00] going on right now because of the pandemic, sometimes there's a disconnection feeling between managers and team members. Sometimes there's a feeling of no trust, especially with a lot of org changes. What can we do to make it feel less of something or more of something, and then finally, looking at the client, how are their clients feeling and how would we want them to feel?

A very easy example, of course, is healthcare. Of course, we want our clients to feel very cared for. We want them to feel like they're empowered and so it really trickles down. If our learners are very anxious and very uptight and they're not feeling cared for, it's going to eventually trickle down into the client level as well. We wouldn't in the healthcare setting, of course, want our clients to feel that way. We wouldn't want our patients to feel that way. We have to really take that into consideration.

When we have all that information, then we make sure that we're, again, constructing our point of view [14:00] from our learner perspective, what their world is, and then we're going to take it and then understand how we can make our world a little bit better. Again, that's really where the learning theories come in as well because we have to make sure that we're looking at the whole package so that we apply that correct learning to make the correct learning intervention. Because we've heard it a million times, training is not always the answer. What if it's just a peer pod-type thing? What if it's a huddle? What if it really is a new learning? We have to make sure that we're constructing the correct type of training intervention using the correct learning theory.

Angeline: When you're establishing, how these learners feel and how their managers feel, organizations come in all shapes and sizes, so what's the best way to go about gathering that data? Like, is it through truly one-on-one surveys with a subset of that population? Or is it through-- I'm sorry, one-on-one interviews I mean, or is it through surveys? If you're doing one-on-one interviews, [15:00] is it better to come from an external source? Do you feel that people are honest during the interviews? Because sometimes it can be uncomfortable when people share feedback. What has your experience been?

Angela: That is definitely a twofold question.

Angeline: Yes. I'm sorry. All my questions are always a little twofold, so I apologize. 

Angela: So are mine, so… There are many ways that you can conduct this type of analysis, and as you intuitively mentioned is that, when you're doing one-on-one interviews, it can feel like there's a trust issue, and so my solution to that is because it could go either way, either you coming in as a designer can be seen as a stranger, or you can be seen as an ally. It depends on the situation and what's going on at the time.

You may need to bring in an external party to conduct some one-on-one interviews, but if you have a group of 1,000 people, one-on-one interviews are not always going to be-- [16:00] That is when it would probably take a couple of weeks to get through that. You can do things like your group sessions, where you're really taking a subset or a set of the population who best represents the population themselves and do some group interviews.

You can host, I've done this before, I posted the sessions when you're really getting in there, and making everybody feel comfortable, and just plotting out your ideas so that everybody feels a little more natural than just having these types of Team or Zoom calls. You can also take a look at survey data. We have some surveys, we have annual employee surveys and data that we put out every single year. We would need to take a look at that because you can usually get a general picture of, how are people really feeling?

You can also ask for client data. Again, in the case of healthcare, for example, that type of data may be a little easier to obtain because we have certain surveys [17:00] and patient satisfaction surveys that we're sending out, so we can really get at a good look. Now, if it's an internal client that we would have to go to the internal client to take a look at how they're really interacting and how they really are feeling about a particular group.

There's multiple ways that you can do that, but again, the key with really, really large groups of populations, really large groups of learners, is you need to make sure that you are finding correct representatives or representatives that would represent the population as a whole.

Angeline: As you've done this, you had mentioned, it shouldn't take extra time. As you've been striving to implement this within your organization and throughout your work, what resistance have you received and how did you overcome that?

Angela: I'm very lucky, telling you the truth is that I have not encountered any resistance, but I do think that--

Angeline: That's awesome.

Angela: It is. Our group is really very, I feel very empowered to do what I need to do within my organization. [18:00] I have some really wonderful management directors that they love learning as much as I do, and so they always back me. The other key to that is that upfront, I am making sure that I let the client know that I'm partnering with them, that it's about the value time, money situation, and make sure that they're very aware of those things and then also letting them know, again, that value that this is going to bring.

We really talk through some of the issues that they might be noticing and saying, "Okay, well, if they're feeling disconnected, then I want to let you know that this training is not going to make them feel even more disconnected." To them, that's value. It's not setting off alarm bells. I would say for anyone who is listening and wants to implement this and thinking, "Oh, well, my clients would never let me do that." Just think of it the angle of time, money value, and how you can make sure [19:00] that you can proposition it as a value to the organization, especially when you're playing on retention. We're not being manipulative, we're being honest. If people are wanting to leave or they're feeling anxious and we're worried about them leaving, let's see what we can do to make them feel less disconnected and less anxious and less inclined to leave.

Susan: Certainly, that ROI has to be very compelling.

Angela: It does.

Angeline: Yes, and I know before we brought you on the podcast, we had asked you to just, because you have tons of examples I'm sure to pull from, to just think about one that would really resonate as we talk today about how you applied empathy to your instructional design approach and what difference you felt you made to the learner. Would you be able to share that before we wrap up today?

Angela: Absolutely. I have an example that I'm very excited to share because it exemplifies how important it is to make sure you put the learner at the center and that you really are choosing the correct learning theory. [20:00] A few years ago, I was approached to create a training that would ensure that a population of learners would meet a certain metric, and so easy enough, right? We just create that training and our learners are going to take it and they're going to magically make that number soar. They're going to meet that metric.

Sounds great, but then, as I did a little more deep dive into the situation, what I learned is a couple of really interesting points is, first of all, the learners knew what the metric was. They knew the process on how to make sure that they met the metric, so what exactly would a training do for them? Not much. Instead, what I took a look at is how are they really feeling, what's really going on here? Now, at this point, some designers would just walk away, and they would say, "Well, it's a performance issue, walk away." I wasn't able to walk away. I said, "Okay, let's find a solution to this." [21:01]

What I found is that the learners were feeling demotivated. They were feeling like, "This is just all that mattered was this metric?" They just felt very amped up, very anxious, unconfident. You can imagine all the feelings that were going with this. They wanted to meet it but they felt so demotivated. "We can't do this. Again, we know the process, we know what we're supposed to do," but they're just shrinking back so much. I said, "Okay." What I did is I made a yearlong program that had really nothing to do with training, which is shocking.

Angeline: Wow. 

Angela: [unintelligible 00:21:39] had learning principles in it. What I did instead is I had, again, a year-long campaign, and it was themed. I ended up making large posters, which is, this is really crossing away from the design world, but again, I do what I have to do. I created posters and postcards that were all themed and would create [22:00] tips and tricks and have some huddle information that managers could pass on, some coaching tips because that's what they needed. They needed to be built up.

What was the foundation of that was social learning. They started to learn from each other but the coaches were their managers as coaches would not only model behavior, but also they were able to listen to exemplary phone calls so they could start to model that behavior. Again, we're not going to rehash all the steps, instead, we're going to try to get them to where they need to be.

I also implemented as part of social learning, implemented badges, and inputs that they could see the badges and they could say, "Look what everything I have," and of course giveaways. That's an example of something that we thought was a learning and that completely went in another direction, [23:00] and a completely different type of educational experience, but it really went well because of the theory that was selected.

Angeline: That is very cool and a great example. It sounds like it really brought a lot of positive energy to the topic as well, which is awesome. Before we close, can you share what's next at Highmark Health for you?

Angela: Absolutely. I am in the leadership space now, which is a very exciting space to be in. We can really empower our leaders to ensure that our team members are happy and to help with retention and make sure everybody feels valued. One of the projects that I'm working on now is really impacting our leadership as a whole. I am ensuring that as part of the design work that I'm putting forth all of the empathetic output, that impact we could say, that will be a [24:00] result of this particular project. It's really exciting to see the connection and show the connection to some of the upper management of when our leaders are feeling this way, this is how our team members are going to feel.

I'm really excited about that again because I think it's just going to make a huge difference in one particular part of the organization. I hope too, that it branches out and can also become a value in the rest of the leadership space.

Angeline: Absolutely. I think it's going to be really meaningful.

Susan: Thanks so much for joining us today, Angela. Really nice to listen to your talk. You're so passionate and I think your insights are inspirational but they're also really actionable. I think a lot of people will have some great takeaways listening to you today. Thank you.

Angela: Thank you.

Angeline: Thank you so much.

Angela: Thank you very, very much for having me. I really do appreciate it.

[24:58]

Susan: Angela definitely had some great practical approaches to using empathetic principles and learning to get better results. What are some of your key takeaways, Angeline?

Angeline: Yes. Oh, my gosh, I loved hearing from her today. I think my biggest takeaway is that it's just critical that we dig deeper when we're creating learner profiles and really just go beyond the characteristics that are just surface level and actually think how they feel, and then having that willingness to pivot our training approach so we're aligning with their cognitive and emotional states.

Susan: How do you use this kind of thinking at d'Vinci, Angeline?

Angeline: As she was talking, I was giggling to myself. The empathetic principles really feel complimentary to learning experience design principles. At d'Vinci, we've been providing more and more learning experience design services over just our content development services and learning experience design really recognizes the importance of designing a solution that's human-centered, so we're always striving to create a positive learning experience like Angela discussed with us today. To get there, that means hearing from your learners firsthand and getting their input so you're really [26:00] developing that holistic profile. I feel like they go hand-in-hand and it's really, I wouldn't say one and the same, but they're part--

Susan: Complimentary. Yes.

Angeline: Yes.

Susan: Thanks, Angeline. Many thanks to Angela Sample of Highmark Health for joining us today. If you have any questions about what we talked about, you can reach out to us on d'Vinci's social channels, through our website, d'Vinci.com, or by emailing us at poweredbylearning@d'Vinci.com.

[music]

Voiceover: Powered by learning is brought to you by d'Vinci Interactive. For more than 25 years, d'Vinci has provided custom learning solutions to government agencies, corporations, medical education and certification organizations, and educational content providers. We can collaborate with our clients to bring order and clarity to content and technology. Learn more at d'Vinci.com.

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